Tuesday, March 31, 2009

Two more Yes Votes

  • Northern New York Yes- voice
  • Long Island: 78-29
As expected.

Limits on Debate at Long Island

The Presbytery of Long Island is scheduled to vote on the amendments today. According to their docket, each person is limited to 1 and 1/2 minutes. Will the "yes on 08" crowd complaint about one of their own limiting debate, like they did for a Presbytery that voted against them?

Anyone who is persuaded by the last minute debate, has not done their homework or is so wishy-washy, that they should not be a delegate. Therefore, 20 years of debate should be enough for everyone.

Thursday, March 26, 2009

Lisa Larges is already breaking the rules.

The Fidelity/Chasity rules applies to Elder, Deacons, and Pastors. A complaint should be filed against her being an Deacon.

Vote Count Spreadsheet Update

I updated the spreadsheet of vote counts up on Google Docs. Pick it up if you want to play. I added the raw counts from Presbyweb, Layman, YesON08, and mine.

Tuesday, March 10, 2009

More from the Yes 08B

I did a little more looking at the Yes ON 08 blog. They continue to use rhetoric that is correct from their point of view:
  • the "don't ask, don't tell" anti-gay policy
  • The anti-gay policy is section G-6.0106b
  • pro-equality vs anti-equality
  • pro-LGBT vs anti-LGBT
  • "You do have to figure that since God has created roughly 3% of the population as gay, many of the voters in this presbytery (Eastern Korean) are voting against equality for their own children, quite possibly without even knowing it."
Their summary of the vote is if not this time, then next time, as the change is shifting in their favor. They are some-what right, because they are Forcing out the out side to EPC with their "hate speech" and "poison the well" attack strategies.

Of course, If I wanted to follow their pattern, I would name the fight as "pro-sin" vs "pro-bible"

Saturday, March 7, 2009

PCUSA troubles.

From the Louisville Newspaper: Presbyterians announce furloughs, salary freeze

They try to blame the economy and then decline in membership much later in the article for past troubles. The truth is people are voting with their feet, either individually, or as a group.

Compare that to this story from Tulsa World Newspaper: Tulsa Baptists shake it up - Name changes, no big office, many committees disbanded

Monday, March 2, 2009

News from the Change 08B crowd

The blog Shuck and Jive has a story on Indian Nations Presbytery vote on "B". It accuses delegates of not allowing a debate on "B". Unfortunately, this blogger has a history of such extreme support for GLBT, that I have to take the report with a grain of salt.

Here is the original report on a different blog: yeson08b. When you look at the site, you notice the typical political trick, Use the right name to slander your opponents instead of logic. They use the phrase "anti–equality" to describe those who want to keep the fidelity/chastity clause. I sure the other side could use "pro-sin" to describe those who want to change 08B.

Presbylaw temporary site.

Announcement Policy

If you have comments, corrections, or updates to this website please email me: PRESBYLAW webmaster or leave a comment.

If you wish to make a church announcement of a vote or lawsuit, I will need to verify. You either need to send it via a email that I can publicly verify belongs to the church, or point to a website with a news story, or official church website. Contacting the layman may be a better route.


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Denomination NameParentLocationSizeYear
United Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A. - UPCUSA(N) PUSA & UPCNA New York City8,909/2,342,4411958-1983
Presbyterian Church in United States (Confederate) - PCUS(S) Presbyterian Church in United States Atlanta, Ga.4,250/814,9311861-1983
Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) PC(U.S.A) UPCUSA(N) & PCUS(S) Louisville, Kentucky11,596/3,122,213June 10, 1983
Evangelical Presbyterian Church EPC UPCUSA(N) & PCUS(S) Livonia, MI67/19,000 (1982)1980/1981
Presbyterian Church of America PCA PCUS(S) Lawrenceville, GA260/41,232May 18, 1973
Orthodox Presbyterian Church Presbyterian U.S.A. Willow Grove, PA 300/20,417 1936
Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church Associate Presbytery/Reformed Presbytery Greenville, SC 250/40,392 1782



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