News Summary

The layman has so much new news today, that it was hard for me to grasp it all. So here is a summary of the actions of Presbytery of Western North Carolina:

• Administrative commision over remnant of First Presbyterian Church in Waynesville, N.C. (Split into two churches: EPC/PCUSA)
• Administrative commission over First Presbyterian Church in Marion, NC. (property only)
• National appeal for financial contributions to help defray Presbytery of Western North Carolina legal costs. Story 2

FPC Baton Rouge votes to Leave

First Presbyterian Church of Baton Rouge voted 425-61 to leave PC(USA) for EPC on Sunday Oct 28, 2007. This was covered by the Advocate (newspaper) online. I also want to call you attention to a very well written letter on the Presbytery of Southern Louisiana website by the General Presbyter, Rev. Dr. Alan D. Cutter. His brick-by-brick description of the problems of PC(USA) is one of the best summaries I have seen. I have saved it, in case it fades from the web.

Hudson Presbyterian Church Owns Property

The website ohio.com says that the court has ruled that the property belongs to the local church and its 500 members and is NOT in trust for PC(USA)! Eastminster Presbytery is considering filling objections to the ruling. The Hudson congregation voted 166-61 on Nov. 5, 2006. For a member's blog check out this site.

Heritage PC Houston, TX, session calls Congregation meeting.

Heritage Presbyterian church's session has called for a congregational meeting to vote on dismissal from PC(USA) to EPC/NW. They and the Presbytery of the New Covenant appear to be handling this in a Christian manner. But I see rumblings from certain people in the presbytery. Hopefully , those who choose to follow the example of Jesus will prevail. My prayers will go out for both sides. This brings my list to 40 churches taking action after PUP.

Website Updated

• Cleanup of info on congregrations split from Hendersonville
• Added Google map of Churches on the list.
• Added Google map of Churches in EPC.
• Church List Moved to new page I am blogging too much and the page is crowded.
• Added links from the churches mentioned to entry on churchlist. Note: on my browser, I have to scroll down a line or two to see the entry.
• Added links to latest letters from Montreat and Hendersonville (Thanks Layman)
• Found a presbytery report of past due per-capita, so I created a graphic of the data. Some of the drops in past-due are due to forgiving of the debt by the presbytery.

Timeline of Presbyterian Mischief

• Sept 2005 - Process for Presbyteries draft
• Dec 2005 - Legal Strategy paper revised.
• Mar 6 2006 - Eastern Oklahoma Presbytery files affidavits file on every church in presbytery.
• Apr 12, 2006 - EOP affidavits revealed.
• Aug 9, 2006 - Louisville papers revealed.
• Aug 15, 2006 - Kirk of the Hills (Tulsa,OK) session votes to disaffiliate.
• Aug 18, 2006 - 3rd paper "revealed"
• Aug 30, 2006 - Kirk's congregation votes to disaffiliate.

It looks like the whole property mess started in Tulsa, OK! Why? Here are some possibilities:

• Fear of Kirk of the Hills leaving due to New Wineskins.
• EOP's General Presbyter is dedicated to PC (USA).
• Louisville (Stated Clerk) talked EOP into the affidavits.
• Budget worries from loss of churches.
• Fear of mass exodus.
• EOP has one light church.

Comments Please!

More News

• From the minutes from the Presbytery of the Mississippi called meeting of Aug 14, and Aug 27:
• Dismissed Covent Presbyterian Church, Jackson, MS to EPC.
• Actions on Grace Chapel
• Stayed the actions of Cong. meeting
• Declared the pulpit vacant
• Appointed an Admin. Comm.
• Presbytery of Western North Carolina dissolved Hephzibah Presbyterian Church (Jan 28,2006)! According to Layman Property Edition (Volume 39, Number 4 / September 2006)

News News News

Just a list of important Presbyterian news:

• PCUSA: Wildfires destroy Malibu Presbyterian Church (287 members), After Fire Pictures: 1 2
• IRD Commentary: Per Capita—Going, Going, Gone!
• The Morning Call: A rift grows over Scripture
• Layman: Two large Sacramento Presbytery churches request dismissal to EPC

Beverly Heights Presbyterian Church Dismissed

According to the Pittsburgh Post Gazette Newspaper website Beverly Heights Presbyterian Church (267 members) was dismissed by the Pittsburgh Presbytery by a vote of 174-73-2. Beverly Heights voted on April 22, 2007 to requess dismissal by a vote of 195-4. The Presbytery website has the dismissal agreeement and a FAQ about the dismissal. According to the Oct presbytery packet, BH "owed" about $77,000 in back per-capita (2000-2007). Interestingly, for the entire presbytery the total for 2004+ thru 2007 is

• $1,548,200 expected
• $735,025 paid (47%)
• $813,174 unpaid

The conditions listed are:

• Promised not to sue each other.
• Church to pay $250,000 over the next ten years w/lien to guarantee.
• Church forfeit of trust fund of $46,655
• Church gets to keep land and name ($1,160,100)

A Review of a Critic

I gathered some information on Carol Joan Schaef, a member of Memorial Park in McCandless, PA. She seems to accuse EPC of many things while condemning EPC for accusing PCUSA of many things. Her man objection to changing denominations is "personal pain following church separation." I have not found where she defends the changes at PCUSA. After reading all of her comments, I have little respect for her viewpoints or her actions. The decision has been made by the vast majority: 951-93. It is time for those in the minority to either accept the decision or to graciously move on to another church. One of the members of our church left for another PCUSA church and unlike others, he did so graciously and did not speak ill of those he left behind. I still have respect for him, even when I do not agree with some of his opinions. This is the sign of a true Christian. Here is the list of her blogs/letters. Unfortunately, Layman does not allow a direct link to individual letters.

• Presbyterian Outlook forum post 6/4/2007 EPC/NW is destructive.
• 2 posts: Presbyterian Outlook 9/26/2007 EPC is no better and 10/11/2007 Lockout of "stayers"
• Presbyterian Outlook: 7/29/2007 No respect for desentors at MPC
• New Wineskins blog 7/24/2007: Pain of Seperation
• Layman 9/10/2007 Peter's Creek - Pain of Separation, EPC women. Also a response from Rev. Austin Olive.
• Layman 6/20/2007 Memorial Park vote was biased.

Londonderry Presbyterian Church

I recommend you read the letters to the editor at Layman Online about Londonderry Presbyterian Church, they give both sides of the split. I may be prejudiced but I see very bad behavior on the part of the PCUSA writers, newspaper and very thoughtful and prayerful consideration on the church side. Unfortunately, this same behavior is playing out, over and over and over again. It seems every split that occurs is meet with deceit, power-graping, and greed. I am still ashamed of my own presbytery actions (Eastern Oklahoma) against Kirk of the Hills and every single church in the Presbytery (affidavits).

Is Joan Gray living in a different dimension?

A Christian Post news story quotes Moderator Joan Gray, as saying "Anger, Mistrust Has Abated"!

Another snippet from the new story: "Over a year later, church officials do not feel a mass exodus of congregations is as threatening today." My list is up to 35 from the time of PUP approval, June 2006. A few more started the exodus just before PUP, that I wonder if they were related.

Does Joan really believe this? Does she just say this for good PR? Is she saying this to bolster the fight? Start Trek did many shows on alternative realities, I did not think Joan actually would prove it.

Why I left PCUSA!

Not me (yet), but this blog (Recovering Presbyterian-now ex-presbyterian) gives a excellent explanation why more and more are leaving PCUSA and have decided that "stay and fight" is no longer a viable option.