Friday, May 22, 2009

Property battle over FPC, Oakfield NY

Layman Story:

The remnants of the congregation that split from the Presbyterian Church (USA) two years ago dropped its appeal and surrendered the property to the Presbytery of Genesee Valley on May 19.

Thursday, May 21, 2009

Divest this! More info from the Boycott Israel campaign

Blog: Divest This!:

An interesting quote:

with politics filling a void left by a spiritual vacuum among churches dealing with modernity

Redford Avenue PC Detroit closing and merging

Detroit News
  • consolidate with the Southfield Presbyterian Church
  • Redford Avenue PC on West McNichols near Grand River
  • 130 members left
  • It once boasted a membership of 3,000 parishioners.
  • $8,000 budget deficit
  • four-story, 44,000 square-foot red-brick building
  • 103-year old

FPC Aurora request dismissal from Blackhawk to EPC

Layman Story:
  • First Presbyterian Church in Aurora, Ill.
  • Blackhawk Presbytery
  • to Evangelical Presbyterian Church
  • Rev. Jeffrey Moore
  • Administrative commission
  • April 5 the congregation voted 317-17 (95 percent) to request dismissal
  • 847-members
  • Blackhawk Presbytery is the home presbytery of Mark Tammen, associate stated clerk and a constitutional lawyer for the denomination. He was among the group that produced the “Louisville Papers,”

UPDATED Layman Story: “We’re going to dismiss them,” John Rickard, the executive for the Blackhawk Presbytery, told The Layman Online Friday. “We’re not trying to beat up on each other.”

Friday, May 8, 2009

Better Statistics

The GA Junkie blog has a set of articles on the vote to replace F/C, 08-B.

Thursday, May 7, 2009

Maybe Abstain does not count inside the Presbytery?

From the Voting Protocol on PCSUA:
... Also, in case anyone should ask, when the presbytery votes on an amendment, the question is decided by a simple majority vote. No absentee or proxy votes are allowed.

I know this is NOT the case for the overall vote, abstains count as NO. According to the PCUSA Book of Order. So I would like to know the source of this instruction.

Thur May 7 Voting

  2009 2001
Presbytery RemoveF/CAbs RemoveF/CAbs
Middle Tennessee 95139  95118 
Northern Waters 5211  4130 

Neither one seems to have the agenda for public consumption. Northern Waters hides it behind a login.

Wednesday, May 6, 2009

The Hidden Cause of Financial Collapse

For a slow "news" day.

I believe the real cause of the financial troubles is the over use of debt in the corporate world. Companies should reinvest in themselves instead of getting loans.

As it is now, If you don't have a large debt, someone with big pockets, will swoop in and do a LBO (leverage buyout). Carl Icahn and Boone Pickens were noted for this tactic, as corporate raiders.

Friday, May 1, 2009

Macrame Cross - Where to find it.

I am looking to buy a replacement for my macrame cross. It is white on the front/back and black along the edges. The knots are "square" and it is on a black string that is a fused joint. All of the string appears to be nylon. No beads, no metal. I THINK I bought it 20 years ago at a D.C. Talk Concert at a Carmen Family Conference. Click on the pictures to see it in full scale.

Presbylaw temporary site.

Announcement Policy

If you have comments, corrections, or updates to this website please email me: PRESBYLAW webmaster or leave a comment.

If you wish to make a church announcement of a vote or lawsuit, I will need to verify. You either need to send it via a email that I can publicly verify belongs to the church, or point to a website with a news story, or official church website. Contacting the layman may be a better route.


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Denomination NameParentLocationSizeYear
United Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A. - UPCUSA(N) PUSA & UPCNA New York City8,909/2,342,4411958-1983
Presbyterian Church in United States (Confederate) - PCUS(S) Presbyterian Church in United States Atlanta, Ga.4,250/814,9311861-1983
Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) PC(U.S.A) UPCUSA(N) & PCUS(S) Louisville, Kentucky11,596/3,122,213June 10, 1983
Evangelical Presbyterian Church EPC UPCUSA(N) & PCUS(S) Livonia, MI67/19,000 (1982)1980/1981
Presbyterian Church of America PCA PCUS(S) Lawrenceville, GA260/41,232May 18, 1973
Orthodox Presbyterian Church Presbyterian U.S.A. Willow Grove, PA 300/20,417 1936
Associate Reformed Presbyterian Church Associate Presbytery/Reformed Presbytery Greenville, SC 250/40,392 1782



News Crosswalk The Intersection of Faith and Life
News Church Report National business news magazine
NewsPC(USA) NewsPresbyterian Church (U.S.A.) News Service
NewsSave Hollywood PresLinks to news about PC(USA) Troubles
NewsThe Layman OnlineTHE News Source about PC(USA)
NewsLayman - propertyThe Layman - Property Issues Archive
Blog Reformed Pastor EPC Pastor - Church Planter
BlogFull Court PresbyPastor Lance's Blog to his Congregation about PUP etc.
BlogClassical PresbyterianBlogging for the Reformed Resistance in the PC(USA)
BlogAnderson SpeakCommentary on Faith, Christianity, and the PCUSA by Noel K. Anderson
BlogBayou Christian Bill Crawford, Pastor First Presbyterian Church of Thiboduax
Blogblog 137Pastor Dave Moody, Trinity United Presbyterian Church, Sparta, IL.
BlogTruth in Love NetworkA group of Presbyterian elders who are concerned with the direction of the PC(USA).
BlogMark D. RobertsProfessor & Senior Pastor of Irvine Presbyterian Church, CA
BlogInstitute on Religion and Democracy25 years of working to reform the social and political witness of American churches
Blog The Berkley Blog James D. Berkley, Director of Presbyterian Action
BlogTom's ThoughtsTom Gray, Co-Pastor, Kirk of the Hills, Tulsa, OK
WebStand to ReasonChristian Ambassadors for defense for classical Christianity
WebPresbyterian ForumWorking for reformation through overt political action
WebWiki:PresbyterianWikipedia's Presbyterian Overview
WebKirk Of The Hills, Tulsa, OKChurch in Tulsa, OK - Fighting for its Property.
WebKirk's Legal Docs (pdfs)Kirk Of The Hills, Tulsa, OK
WebKirk Docs (text)Kirk Of The Hills docs, Converted to text
PDFLegal Strategy #1PC(USA)'s Legal Strategy for churches wanting to leave
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DocSecret Document #3News about a third secret document
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WebPresby Chart 2Presbyterian Church History-Lesson 13-An Overview of Contemporary American Presbyterianism
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PDFBook of OrderOfficial PDF Copy of Book of Order for PC(USA)
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WebAdvisory OpinionsPC(USA) Stated Clerk Advisory Opinions (not binding, nor authoritative)
WebPC(USA) Constitutional MusingsOffice of Constitutional Services - Unofficial Thoughts
WebPC(USA) Amicus Curiae BriefsStated Clerk & AC on Litigation - Friend of the Court Briefs
WebGAPJC PC(USA)PC(USA) General Assembly Permanent Judicial Commission Decisions
WebPension Board PC(USA)PC(USA) Board of Pensions
WebFoundation PC(USA)Presbyterian Foundation, New Covenant Trust and New Covenant Mutual Funds
WebPC(USA) BOO AnnotatedPC(USA) Book of Order - Annotated
WebPresbyterian CoalitionWorking for a Revitalized Church
WebConfessing Church Movement1,314/434,697
WebNew WineskinsNew Wineskins Association of Churches(2001)

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